When Helping Hurts: Brian Fikkert's Approach to Poverty

When Helping Hurts: Brian Fikkert's Approach to Poverty

In this episode of Peaceful Life Radio, hosts David Lowry and Don Drew welcome Brian Fikkert, founder of the Chalmers Center for Economic Development and Professor of Economics at Covenant College. Brian, co-author of 'When Helping Hurts: How to Alleviate Poverty Without Hurting The Poor and Yourself,' discusses the complexities of poverty and the pitfalls of traditional aid methods. He delves into the concept of the 'God Complex,' the importance of relational approaches over material handouts, and the necessity of understanding both individual and systemic factors that contribute to poverty. The discussion also covers effective strategies like microlending, patient capital, and the pivotal role of community engagement and development in achieving sustainable change. Tune in for a thought-provoking conversation that challenges conventional wisdom and offers insightful, practical advice for meaningful poverty alleviation.

00:00 Introduction and Guest Welcome
00:26 Brian Fickard's Background and Work
01:19 Understanding Poverty and the God Complex
03:31 The American Dream and Human Flourishing
05:05 Ethic of Care and Restoring Relationships
06:46 Common Mistakes in Poverty Alleviation
08:02 Relief, Rehabilitation, and Development
10:09 Systemic Issues and Individual Brokenness
17:51 Microfinance and Local Capacities
22:02 Volunteering and Making an Impact
24:19 Brian Fickard's New Book and Closing Remarks

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Transcript

When Helping Hurts: Brian Fikkert's Approach to Poverty

Introduction and Guest Welcome

Brian Fikkert: Many of us have been enculturated into a story that we call the American Dream of rugged individualism that pursues greater and greater amounts of material prosperity. There's something wrong with the story of the American dream and I think the basic issue is we don't understand what human flourishing looks like. We've reduced human flourishing to greater and greater material consumption when all of the research suggests that human flourishing comes from a healthy relationships with God, self, others, and our environment. 

David Lowry: That was Brian Fikkert from the Chalmer Center for Economic Development and Professor of Economics and Community Development at Covenant College. He's our guest today on Peaceful Life Radio. So glad you're with us. I'm David Lowry, and as always, my good friend Don Drew is with us today. 

Don Drew: Hello everyone. I'm doing good today and I'm excited about our guest. 

David Lowry: Don, why don't you introduce Brian and tell us why he's on our program, let's hear about Brian. 

Don Drew: Absolutely. 

Brian Fikkert's Background and Work

Don Drew: Brian Fikkert is the founder of the Chalmers Center for Economic Development and Professor of Economics and Community Development at Covenant College. He holds a PhD in economics from Yale with specialties in international economics and economic development. Brian is best known as the co-author, of When Helping Hurts: How to alleviate poverty Without Hurting The Poor and Yourself, which has shaped how churches and ministries around the world approach poverty alleviation.

His work centers on restoring broken relationships at the heart of poverty. I first came upon Brian's work in 2009 when building houses for the poor in Honduras, and it helped me transform my thinking about poverty, my own God complex, which we'll talk about in a minute, and led me to teach social entrepreneurship at my university for 15 years. So I have a personal appreciation for Brian and his team. Brian, welcome to Peaceful Life Radio. 

Brian Fikkert: It's so great to be with you today. Thank you so much, 

Don Drew: Brian. 

Understanding Poverty and the God Complex

Don Drew: In your book, When Helping Hurts, you describe what you call a God Complex as a major obstacle in helping others. Can you help unpack how this complex manifest itself in well-intentioned individuals?

Brian Fikkert: Thanks for that question. When we try to work with people who are poor, the most important thing we can do is ask the following question, what is poverty? the way that we diagnose the problem determines the solutions we use to alleviate the problem. Most of us, in America define poverty as a lack of some material resource, a lack of food, a lack of clothing, a lack of housing.

But if you ask materially poor people around the world and across the US, What is poverty? They'll tend to say things like this. I feel shame. I feel less than human. I feel like garbage that nobody wants. I feel like I have no voice. So the poor tend to define their poverty in far more relational terms, and we tend to define poverty in material terms.

 That difference in diagnosis really creates a problem and shows up in the area of the God complex because, human beings are hardwired for relationship. I believe we're hardwired for relationship with God, ourselves, others, and the environment. That relationship with self has to do with our self image, our self concept, how we conceive of who we are. Materially poor people around the world tend to think of themselves as less than, as inferior, as lacking capacity. 

Those of us with material resources, make the inverse mistake. We tend to think of ourselves as better than, as superior people who are uniquely gifted to bring our wisdom and resources to solve the problem of poverty. People who are materially poor suffer from a marred identity.

We tend to suffer from what some have called a God complex, a sense of superiority. And when those two things collide or interact with each other, the God complex and the marred identity, it's a bad mix. 

A theory of change asks two questions. What's the goal and how can the goal be achieved? 

The American Dream and Human Flourishing

Brian Fikkert: And so many of us have been enculturated in a story that's not actually the right story. Many of us have been enculturated into a story that we call the American Dream of rugged individualism that pursues greater and greater amounts of material prosperity. While there's good in that story, and there's certainly good in material prosperity, the truth of the matter is America isn't doing that well. If you look at almost any indicator, the self-reported happiness of Americans is on the decline. Anxiety and depression are exploding. There's been a straight upward trajectory in anxiety and depression amongst college age young people in America. There's something wrong with the story of the American dream and I think the basic issue is we don't understand what human flourishing looks like. We've reduced human flourishing to greater and greater material consumption. When all of the research suggests what I was saying earlier, that human flourishing comes from healthy relationships with God, self, others, and our environment. And so we've got the wrong story, the wrong theory of change. And we tend to impose that wrong story onto poor people. 

There's a better story for all of us. It's a story of relationship, it's a story of community, and we need to live into that story ourselves, and create the opportunity for people materially poor to live into that story as well.

Ethic of Care and Restoring Relationships

David Lowry: Brian, one of the things I've studied is called the ethic of care. One of the pillars of that ethic is, don't presume that you know what a person needs. People in the Helping Professions will often come in wanting to give of themselves to help others and kind of a rookie mistake is to come in and say, I know what this person needs and here I am to deliver it. Don't do that. 

Brian Fikkert: Don't do that. When we relate to people out of a sense of, We know what they need, we know what's best, we have the answers for them, it undermines humanness. It undermines dignity. It undermines what we're called to be. Again, dealing with people who are suffering from broken relationships with God, self, others, and the environment, the goal is to restore people to right relationship. The opposite of poverty isn't more stuff. The opposite of poverty is right relationship and that dignity and capacity should express itself in stewarding, in managing our own gifts, our own resources, our own abilities, our own talents, not just to serve ourselves, but to serve God and to serve others.

And so the proper approach is not, What's wrong with you and how can I fix you? The proper approach is what gifts and abilities and resources do you have? What do you think you are called to do with those, gifts and resources and abilities. And how can I walk with you in the process of you stewarding what you've been given? It's a different approach.

Don Drew: Brian, you've worked with a lot of different organizations and people who are involved in poverty alleviation. 

Common Mistakes in Poverty Alleviation

Don Drew: What are some examples of common mistakes well-intentioned people make? 

Brian Fikkert: I can go on all day on this one. The fundamental issue is misdiagnosing the cause of poverty, to define poverty in material terms, a lack of food, a lack of clothing, a lack of housing. The poor tend to define their poverty in more relational, sociological, psychological, and even spiritual terms. So the first mistake is having a material framework instead of a relational framework. That's the number one mistake. 

I would say the second mistake is treating all cases of poverty equally. And what I mean by that is this, imagine that homeless person who is standing on the street corner and then imagine a person who is in Indonesia and is experiencing a tsunami. On the surface both parties are lacking adequate food, clothing, and shelter. But the underlying condition is very different. The failure to distinguish between different underlying conditions can cause a lot of harm. And so in our book, When Helping Hurts, we make a distinction between relief and rehabilitation in development. 

Relief, Rehabilitation, and Development

Brian Fikkert: Relief is the right approach when a person or a community is completely destitute, is unable to contribute anything to their improvement because they're in a crisis.

So, a community experiencing a tsunami is in a crisis. While the waters are rushing in, the houses are being leveled, the people in that situation are helpless. They need relief. Relief is doing something to people or for people because they can't help themselves.

But once the crisis is over, we should move into rehabilitation. We should move from doing things for people and into doing things with people, walking with people to restore them to the pre-crisis conditions, asking them to contribute something, asking them to participate in their own recovery.

Development is the final idea. It's the concept of walking with people across times so that both they, and we experience greater degrees of human flourishing, so relief and rehab and development. 

The number one mistake that people make in the space of poverty alleviation, is providing relief over long periods of time to people who actually need development. The vast majority of materially poor people around the world are not in a crisis. They're in a bad situation. They really do need help, but they're not in a crisis. They're not helpless. Rather, they're in a chronic state of poverty. And for such people, the right approach is not relief. It's not just a handout. It's development. It's walking together across time in ways that are restorative to both parties. The people in Indonesia in a tsunami need relief. The homeless gentleman in the street corner is in a chronic state of poverty needs development.

David Lowry: I've been reading Howard Thurman recently and he's talking about the poor, particularly here in America. He focused upon the notion of poverty from systemic issues. How do ordinary good hearted people who have a heart for helping not make things worse? 

Brian Fikkert: There's so much in your question. 

Systemic Issues and Individual Brokenness

Brian Fikkert: One of the key issues dividing America right now is the question of Is poverty caused by individual brokenness, or is it caused by oppressive and broken systems? Democrats, of course, tend to emphasize broken oppressive systems. Republicans tend to emphasize broken individuals. The first step is actually to get over ourselves.

 Of course individuals are broken. I know I am. And of course, systems are broken. The first step is just a predisposition that would put down our political differences and be open to the possibility, that both things could be in play, that there's both individual behaviors, sometimes addictions that can contribute to material poverty, but there's also broken systems that contribute to material poverty. So the first step is just to be open. 

And then secondly, just to listen really well. To walk with people, to listen to their stories. And that doesn't mean that their version of their story is completely true. But listening is part of healing. Listening is part of understanding. Listening is part of us gaining a new perspective as to what's going on. 

The third thing I would say is try accessing some systems together with the person with whom you're walking. A number of years ago, a fellow became part of my life who is homeless andsuffering from all kinds of mental health issues. There's no question that he has tremendous individual brokenness. But my word, I walked with him trying to access systems that are trying to help him. These systems, are not trying to oppress him. He's had some of those in his life as well. He's experienced racial discrimination. He's experienced oppressive systems. But walkingwith him through systems that are supposed to be helping him was very eye-opening to me. They're not trying to be oppressive, but they don't work very well. I remember going with him to meet with one case manager. I have a PhD. From Yale University, I couldn't understand half of what she was saying. She didn't share the right information with him. I had to keep pressing, asking questions from different angles to uncover the right answer. There's no way he could have done that. So walk with a person through time, start to experience the world as they experience it, and suddenly, the reality of broken systems will become more apparent than immediately meets the eye for those of us who are not struggling with those systems in the same way. 

Don Drew: Brian, about 15 years ago I was doing a lot of work in East Africa, and I was introduced to a book called Dead Aid by, I think it's Dambiso Moyo yeah. I believe I have that name correct. What was really interesting here is an African economist essentially saying that this aid system is not working. And in fact, what it's doing is creating dependency. that's what relief, when it's extended too long, does. It creates dependency, weakness and sends the message collectively to the people that we in the west, know what you need, we are going to give you what you need. And, that is infectious in bad ways to a society and their self-esteem.

Brian Fikkert: I should back up a little bit and say, folks, this is not easy. It's not like people come up to you with a sign on them that says relief is the appropriate approach to me. And another person comes up with a sign that is, development is the appropriate approach for me. It takes wisdom. It takes getting to know people. There's no simple formula, but there's a very helpful rule, that my co-author Steve Corbett taught me. It's this, avoid paternalism. And paternalism can be defined as habitually providing resources or doing things for people, that they can provide or do for themselves.

Now, let's not be jerks, we all do things for people just to lend a helping hand, even if they could do it for themselves, but it's when we're habitually doing things. It's when there's a dynamic of always doing things for people, that they can do for themselves, that we're gonna run into trouble.

Don Drew: We send a message that we don't believe they can do it. It's, disempowering, actually. 

Brian Fikkert: Disempowering, that's exactly right. It's very difficult to actually create a system that listens to the people on the ground. All the incentives are to listen to other people. It's very hard to create a system that actually listens to the people on the ground, takes what they're saying seriously, and responds to it in ways that are empowering.

We need really patient money. Money that doesn't say, you know, what's the body count today? How many people are you gonna feed today? How many people are gonna listen to this message today? And there's a reason for that. We want metrics, right? We want metrics and measurements. The problem is that poverty is fundamentally rooted in broken relationships with God, self, others, and the environment. The way to really help people who are in material poverty is to stop treating symptoms, get right down to the root causes, which are relational, and it takes a long period of time of walking in, empowering restorative relationships to address the root of the problem. And so what we need is not less money. We need more money, but the money needs to be channeled to organizations and ministries that walk with people in highly relational ways across time. Lemme give you a quick example. I know of an organization that works in a very low income neighborhood in Baltimore. I had the opportunity to visit them almost 30 years ago. You're driving through this very low income neighborhood in Baltimore, and suddenly it's like an oasis in the middle of the whole thing. There's rehabbed homes. There's kids playing in the streets. There's all kinds of joy in the air.

And I met with the guys who started that ministry and I said to them how did you rehab 150 homes? Could you show me the blueprints? Could you show me the spreadsheets? And they said Brian, you're asking us two different questions. They said, Brian, the way we rehabbed the homes was we spent three years hanging out with people. We played stickball in the street with kids. We flew kites in the park. We went to parent teacher association meetings. We hung out with people for three years. They said, The foundation of people and the foundation of a community is relationship.

Houses are just bricks and mortar. What you need to do is establish a foundation of empowering relationships, and once that's established, you can build houses all day long. It's the relational foundation that the houses are built on. That's the key. And they said we could have rushed in with contractors and bulldozers and construction crews. That's not what we did. We hung out with people, developed a foundation of relationship. And then out of those relationships, the people wanted to rebuild their own community. They wanted to rebuild their own houses. They wanted to spend the sweat equity. They wanted to do the work. So the real way to get houses built is to hang out with people. And that's what we as financial resource partners don't ever understand. We want quick results. We want quick metrics. When it's really about empowering relationships, we need people to give to empowering relationships. 

Microfinance and Local Capacities

Don Drew: Brian as I mentioned earlier about social entrepreneurship, there's this concept known as microlending and micro banking it's a way of putting banking into poor communities where people can borrow money and build their businesses which otherwise they haven't been able to do in the past. And Kiva, yeah is a big organization where an individual can go and actually find a entrepreneur in a poverty area and be able to borrow money to grow their business, and then pay that money back. And so the money keeps giving.

Brian Fikkert: Yeah, I love that. I'm very fond of Kiva. I haven't looked at 'em lately, but the general idea of Kiva is something I really appreciate. I love microfinance microlending. I think it's has a lot of promise, a lot of power behind it. But it's also an example of something that illustrates something we were saying earlier. So often, we take what's called a needs-based approach with people who are poor. 

Well, it turns out that the history of microfinance is an example of this problem. So be careful here. I like Kiva and I like micro lending but what we could do is start off by saying to people who are poor, what gifts and resources do you have? Could you actually save money? And it turns out poor people are able to save. They do save. They want to save. They simply lack a financial system, a bank, in which to save. So as we start with a needs-based approach, we immediately say, oh, they need capital. But what if they actually have capital locally? And it turns out that they do. And so an alternative approach to Microfinances to say, let's provide a mechanism in which poor people can save and lend their own money. It's a different approach. It starts off with the assets that are already there. Now there's limits to this. Typically, they can't accumulate all that they need for larger businesses in which we need outside money, to augment the local resources, but the very poorest people in the world don't have the capacity to manage a loan from Kiva. But they can save and lend to each other. 

And the Chalmer Center, has been an organization promoting a savings led approach to microfinance. It just illustrates the point. Focus on local assets, focus on local capacity. And so you never wanna squash local resources, local abilities, local capacities cause that's where the sustainability is gonna come from. 

David Lowry: We all need a helping hand, but that helping hand doesn't extend all the time. 

Brian Fikkert: So many materially poor people assume there's something wrong with them, that they can't do it. The goal is to get them out of that narrative, to say, you have abilities, you have capacities, you can do things. And I'm gonna walk with you as you discover what you can do.

Extremely important. I wanna add one more thing here. Sometimes people listen to me talk and think the message is, stop giving money. That's not my message at all. My message is that whatever you are giving, you ought to quadruple it. But give it differently. Instead of hurling resources around In highly impersonal ways, find organizations that really are walking with people who are poor in highly relational, highly empowering ways, and write bigger checks to them because quite frankly, that approach is far more expensive than simply dispensing soup out of a soup kitchen. A highly relational, highly developmental approach is way more expensive. What we need are people with financial resources to write big checks to organizations, to enable their people to hang out with poor people for long periods of time.

Don Drew: And this kind of investment these days, I think the term that's used most commonly is patient capital. It takes time for these things to work. Brian, our audiences, for the most part, they're gonna be over 50, but a lot of folks might want to be able to help with their resources and maybe even with their time, but don't know how to best do this, especially on a global level. 

Volunteering and Making an Impact

Brian Fikkert: It's a great question. There's a huge need for volunteers with time to develop relationships. What we don't need are people rushing into low income communities, hammering, bunch of nails, and leaving. We need people to volunteer in the afterschool tutoring program week in, week out. We need people to develop empowering relationships. And quite frankly, people in this stage of life sometimes they have more time and huge, huge, huge contribution they can make is by volunteering consistently to walk with people. 

There's a tremendous amount of research about the high rate of return to early childhood interventions. It turns out from the time of conception to about the age of three, is where the whole ball game is played. And a huge thing is to hug children , rock babies and read stories. The rate of return to that is off the chart. It affects brain development. It affects neurological development that lasts a lifetime. So, volunteer, hug children.

To make an impact on a larger scale, the first thing is to find organizations that are using highly developmental, asset-based, empowering approaches. In our book, When Helping Hurts and a subsequent book, we've written, Becoming Whole, there's all kinds of guidelines in there that you can use to explore, to examine organizations to figure out which ones are really using empowering asset-based developmental approaches and then, be faithful givers to them. We need good board members, oh my word, good board members who understand something about governance. Who understand the relational nature of poverty. Having people with business experience come alongside me as board members or advisors has been huge for me. There's a number of people in our audience today who have business background, who can come alongside of the CEO, walk with them patiently, be a sounding board, be a trusted listener, be somebody who's gonna be there through thick and thin. The role for that at a board level or a friendship advisor is off the charts and huge potential value added there.

Brian Fickard's New Book and Closing Remarks

David Lowry: Brian, tell us more about what you're working on, your new book. We wanna hear all of the work you're doing. Bring us up to speed. 

Brian Fikkert: When Helping Hurts came out we noticed something. As my co-author and I would be out speaking in different places, people come up and ask us very specific questions. People needed wisdom. They needed to know what the goal is and how to go about trying to achieve that goal. So we'd decide to write a book called Becoming Whole, why the Opposite of Poverty Isn't The American Dream. Basically we build on the ideas of When Helping Hurts but go deeper into what is the right theory of change and how can we promote that theory of change for people who are poor and ourselves? 

Don Drew: Brian Fikkert's book, When Helping Hurts is Subtitled: How to Alleviate Poverty Without Hurting The Poor and Yourself transformed my thinking about how I was both helping and hurting the poor. I hope he's giving you something that will energize your desire to give back in positive and effective ways. Brian, thank you for being on Peaceful Life Radio. 

Brian Fikkert: It's been a joy to be with you, thank you so much.